It's painful to be accused of lying, which is a common accusation evolutionists make of creationists. There's no lying involved. Why can't they just get it through their heads that we do not trust their "science," that most of it is imaginary, that what facts they can produce don't undermine our own theories which have a lot more than a few facts going for them, that we do not see their "evidence" as evidence for their theories but as open to interpretation, that in fact they don't HAVE evidence as they think they do, and we are quite legitimately pursuing our own interpretation of the information we have. This level of accusation amounts to a form of violence.

This is from EvC forum, a poster who calls himself Coyote:

I've read a lot of those articles, particularly in the fields of radiocarbon dating and fossil man, two areas with which I am familiar.

I've seen some real whoppers passed off to the willfully ignorant as TRVTH. One prime example:

The relevant evidence clearly shows that Homo sapiens sensu lato is a separate and distinct entity from the other hominids. No overall evolutionary progression is to be found. Adam and Eve, and not the australopiths/habilines, are our actual ancestors. As pointed out by other creationists [e.g., Lubenow9], Homo ergaster, Homo erectus, Homo heidelbergensis, and Homo neanderthalensis can best be understood as racial variants of modern man–all descended from Adam and Eve, and most likely arising after the separation of people groups after Babel (Source).

Now I can go into the details if you wish, but among other gems this little paragraph has macroevolution, which creationists deny occurs, happening several hundred times faster than paleontologists propose and in reverse! And then, for some unknown reason, stopping abruptly and all traces of these critters suddenly burrowed down into geological layers tens to hundreds of thousands, or millions, of years too old.

Without knowing more about the specimens they have identified as homo this and that, it seems to me that "racial variant" is usually the best interpretation of any such skeletal remains as they find that really are from human beings, in keeping with CREATIONIST assumptions.

Why after the Flood though? If they're fossilized (it doesn't say) they were most likely pre-Flood.

This kind of thinking is not a "whopper" and evolutionists need to get some basic civility into their arguing style. They interpret everything in terms of their own assumptions and we in terms of ours. Lies have nothing to do with it.

Here's Coyote again in Message 72 of that same thread:

Lies

It does matter to the creationists because as christians we find it important not to lie. To lie is to sin against God which is the opposite of the way that christians are trying to live their lives.

But the web is full of creationist lies; when creationists argue a point of belief (e.g., the "global" flood) and the facts are pointed out to them time after time, but they still come back with the same argument time after time--that can only be called a lie (although possibly it is self-delusion, i.e., lying to one's self).

That's because your "facts" are NOT convincing, and somehow this has to be gotten across better than it has been. You do NOT have proper evidence for the claims you make. YOU are convinced, YOU think it's all sewn up tight. WE DON'T.

About the global flood, your "facts" are NOTHING BUT SPECULATIONS, I've been there and I know that's all they are. You come up with ideas about what would have or could have happened that you say defeats the idea of a worldwide Flood but it's nothing but your own speculation. Meanwhile we DO have facts we can point to and we're not giving them up for a few speculations from you.

I want to check back to this thread to see if he goes into the details he says he can go into. This is necessary if he's to make any sense at all.